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> <channel><title>Comments on: GREEN RANT: Having a Baby is NOT Bad for the Environment</title> <atom:link href="http://www.inhabitots.com/2009/08/07/green-rant-babies-are-eco-baddies-or-so-the-argument-goes/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" /><link>http://www.inhabitots.com/2009/08/07/green-rant-babies-are-eco-baddies-or-so-the-argument-goes/</link> <description>Sustainable design for the next generation!</description> <lastBuildDate>Sun, 21 Mar 2010 16:45:58 +0000</lastBuildDate> <generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=abc</generator> <sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod> <sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency> <item><title>By: Carey</title><link>http://www.inhabitots.com/2009/08/07/green-rant-babies-are-eco-baddies-or-so-the-argument-goes/comment-page-1/#comment-8651</link> <dc:creator>Carey</dc:creator> <pubDate>Tue, 06 Oct 2009 14:21:17 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.inhabitots.com/?p=18633#comment-8651</guid> <description>It is selfless not to have children.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is selfless not to have children.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: laura</title><link>http://www.inhabitots.com/2009/08/07/green-rant-babies-are-eco-baddies-or-so-the-argument-goes/comment-page-1/#comment-5822</link> <dc:creator>laura</dc:creator> <pubDate>Thu, 13 Aug 2009 22:31:31 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.inhabitots.com/?p=18633#comment-5822</guid> <description>Adoption is great, except it doesn&#039;t always work our. I tried adopting 5 years ago, spent a decent amount of money getting everything in order and had two birth mothers change their mind near the end of their pregnancies. It was heart breaking and I finally put that idea on the back burner. I was perfectly able to get pregnant, but I wanted to adopt because there are kids out there that need homes. It can end up so discouraging though. Kudos to those who have difficulties with adoption, yet continue to travel that path!!</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Adoption is great, except it doesn&#8217;t always work our. I tried adopting 5 years ago, spent a decent amount of money getting everything in order and had two birth mothers change their mind near the end of their pregnancies. It was heart breaking and I finally put that idea on the back burner. I was perfectly able to get pregnant, but I wanted to adopt because there are kids out there that need homes. It can end up so discouraging though. Kudos to those who have difficulties with adoption, yet continue to travel that path!!</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Solar Surfer</title><link>http://www.inhabitots.com/2009/08/07/green-rant-babies-are-eco-baddies-or-so-the-argument-goes/comment-page-1/#comment-5782</link> <dc:creator>Solar Surfer</dc:creator> <pubDate>Tue, 11 Aug 2009 09:30:13 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.inhabitots.com/?p=18633#comment-5782</guid> <description>As always, it is interesting to see how people react to, and debate about, such interesting issues. From reading the comments above it seems to me that many factors are being talked about at cross purposes. The old maxim &quot;the more you think about it the hard it gets&#039; springs to mind too. So first of all thanks to all the contributors, you have helped me look at the issue in news ways. secondly here is my 10 cents worth.As an ecologist I am acutely aware of the dire environmental issues stacking up against us maintaining our current oil lubricated western lifestyles for much longer. I am also aware that our present ways are seriously depleting this planets ecosystems. I do not see this as a humans versus other animals issue - if you think about it humans must always be part of the solution and how can we step outside ourselves or the system anyway? I love people, I love our cultural diversity and our amazing creative talents just for starters. I also enjoy interacting with wildlife and wild places. I am under no illusion that the world revolves around me, or humans, or even that life itself on this planet is necessary - My simple understanding of astronomy and the universe puts paid to any such notions. But here&#039;s the rub, our current way of life is massively impacting on the other living things on this planet in a way that I really don&#039;t feel comfortable with. And one of the largest problems is the sheer number of us and the way we live. I would rather that there were fewer of us so that our impacts less dramatic and we lived within a sustainable ecosystem. Not one based on such rampant exploitation. I accept that this is a egocentric argument, in as much as, I would get pleasure if we somehow did this. I have no way of knowing if the other organisms on this planet would be happier with this suggested change (clearly some people couldn&#039;t care less). I am no advocate of extreme measures but would suggest that basic ecological theory indicates that one way or another the massive explosion in human population we are seeing will be regulated in some way - exactly how and when is up for debate, but I would put money on it being sooner rather than later. Surely the preferable way would be with some form of informed and proactive action, rather than some of the alternatives we are staring down the barrel (pun intended)?</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As always, it is interesting to see how people react to, and debate about, such interesting issues. From reading the comments above it seems to me that many factors are being talked about at cross purposes. The old maxim &#8220;the more you think about it the hard it gets&#8217; springs to mind too. So first of all thanks to all the contributors, you have helped me look at the issue in news ways. secondly here is my 10 cents worth.</p><p>As an ecologist I am acutely aware of the dire environmental issues stacking up against us maintaining our current oil lubricated western lifestyles for much longer. I am also aware that our present ways are seriously depleting this planets ecosystems. I do not see this as a humans versus other animals issue &#8211; if you think about it humans must always be part of the solution and how can we step outside ourselves or the system anyway? I love people, I love our cultural diversity and our amazing creative talents just for starters. I also enjoy interacting with wildlife and wild places. I am under no illusion that the world revolves around me, or humans, or even that life itself on this planet is necessary &#8211; My simple understanding of astronomy and the universe puts paid to any such notions. But here&#8217;s the rub, our current way of life is massively impacting on the other living things on this planet in a way that I really don&#8217;t feel comfortable with. And one of the largest problems is the sheer number of us and the way we live. I would rather that there were fewer of us so that our impacts less dramatic and we lived within a sustainable ecosystem. Not one based on such rampant exploitation. I accept that this is a egocentric argument, in as much as, I would get pleasure if we somehow did this. I have no way of knowing if the other organisms on this planet would be happier with this suggested change (clearly some people couldn&#8217;t care less). I am no advocate of extreme measures but would suggest that basic ecological theory indicates that one way or another the massive explosion in human population we are seeing will be regulated in some way &#8211; exactly how and when is up for debate, but I would put money on it being sooner rather than later. Surely the preferable way would be with some form of informed and proactive action, rather than some of the alternatives we are staring down the barrel (pun intended)?</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Beth Shea</title><link>http://www.inhabitots.com/2009/08/07/green-rant-babies-are-eco-baddies-or-so-the-argument-goes/comment-page-1/#comment-5779</link> <dc:creator>Beth Shea</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 10 Aug 2009 22:26:52 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.inhabitots.com/?p=18633#comment-5779</guid> <description>FudeytheWhale- evidently the editors of this site read the articles posted, as well as every comment, including yours. As far as confusing the way we wish the world was, with the way it is... without hope, there is really no point to anything- human life or life without humans.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>FudeytheWhale- evidently the editors of this site read the articles posted, as well as every comment, including yours. As far as confusing the way we wish the world was, with the way it is&#8230; without hope, there is really no point to anything- human life or life without humans.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Roland_Kent-Riladikuj</title><link>http://www.inhabitots.com/2009/08/07/green-rant-babies-are-eco-baddies-or-so-the-argument-goes/comment-page-1/#comment-5777</link> <dc:creator>Roland_Kent-Riladikuj</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 10 Aug 2009 21:43:45 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.inhabitots.com/?p=18633#comment-5777</guid> <description>I don&#039;t choose not to have kids because of the environtment, I just don&#039;t want any. And Yes adoption is a great option. I don&#039;t care to much about this idea of continue the family name or just our basic genetic scripts that physically makes our bodies want to procreate. I don&#039;t believe in any religion that would instruct me to procreate. I just don&#039;t see a point in doing such, at least for me. I&#039;m simply choosing not to. I have brothers, they&#039;ll have kids, so I have nothing to worry about continuing a family legacy. At the same time the arguement that have kids is green make somewhat of a bit of sense. You can&#039;t deny that. And any counter-arguement is pretty redundant, because for one thing there is now way in hell that everyone will stop having babies, so babies will always be born - no doubt. If more people choose not to have babies it will mitigate over-population. But you can look it either way, one hand you have the option to stop making kids and prevent over-population, thus stabilizing the population or on the other hand 6.6 Billion people can continue to have 2 or 3 kids, while healthcare improves, and we can witness for ourselves over-population, which will result in mass-starvation, conflict over resources, strained societal demands, yada-yada-yada, and a lot of people will die (unfortunately) thus the population will be stabilized. Either we get the same result, one way is a bit boring and cold, and the other way, although filled with the love and joy (I guess you&#039;re supposed to feel love and joy when bring life into this world), with ultimately be backlashed by nature&#039;s wrath and extermination.In the end, I think I&#039;d rather see no one die, and certainly not from starvation.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t choose not to have kids because of the environtment, I just don&#8217;t want any. And Yes adoption is a great option. I don&#8217;t care to much about this idea of continue the family name or just our basic genetic scripts that physically makes our bodies want to procreate. I don&#8217;t believe in any religion that would instruct me to procreate. I just don&#8217;t see a point in doing such, at least for me. I&#8217;m simply choosing not to. I have brothers, they&#8217;ll have kids, so I have nothing to worry about continuing a family legacy. At the same time the arguement that have kids is green make somewhat of a bit of sense. You can&#8217;t deny that. And any counter-arguement is pretty redundant, because for one thing there is now way in hell that everyone will stop having babies, so babies will always be born &#8211; no doubt. If more people choose not to have babies it will mitigate over-population. But you can look it either way, one hand you have the option to stop making kids and prevent over-population, thus stabilizing the population or on the other hand 6.6 Billion people can continue to have 2 or 3 kids, while healthcare improves, and we can witness for ourselves over-population, which will result in mass-starvation, conflict over resources, strained societal demands, yada-yada-yada, and a lot of people will die (unfortunately) thus the population will be stabilized. Either we get the same result, one way is a bit boring and cold, and the other way, although filled with the love and joy (I guess you&#8217;re supposed to feel love and joy when bring life into this world), with ultimately be backlashed by nature&#8217;s wrath and extermination.</p><p>In the end, I think I&#8217;d rather see no one die, and certainly not from starvation.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: FudeyTheWhale</title><link>http://www.inhabitots.com/2009/08/07/green-rant-babies-are-eco-baddies-or-so-the-argument-goes/comment-page-1/#comment-5774</link> <dc:creator>FudeyTheWhale</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 10 Aug 2009 18:55:46 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.inhabitots.com/?p=18633#comment-5774</guid> <description>I really don&#039;t mean for this to sound personally insulting but. with all due respect this article is absurd. At no point in the article does the author offer even one piece of evidence that having children doesn&#039;t hurt the environment.Having children DOES hurt the environment. I wish it was not true, but it is.Instead of supporting his argument, the  author implies we should not blame babies for being born and should promote contraception. I&#039;ll agree with those two points, but the fact remains that having babies is not good for the environment. (Humans born into western society where consumption and pollution have a disproportionately massive impact on the environment. Even &quot;green&quot; westerners have a tremendous negative impact on the world environment. They&#039;re only slight less worse than &quot;regular&quot; westerners.)  No matter how much you wish it weren&#039;t so you can&#039;t change reality. Even if the thought of negative population growth is bleak, that doesn&#039;t mean it shouldn&#039;t be done. Please don&#039;t confuse the way you wish the world was with the way it is.Do the editors of this site even read the articles posted?</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I really don&#8217;t mean for this to sound personally insulting but. with all due respect this article is absurd. At no point in the article does the author offer even one piece of evidence that having children doesn&#8217;t hurt the environment.</p><p>Having children DOES hurt the environment. I wish it was not true, but it is.</p><p>Instead of supporting his argument, the  author implies we should not blame babies for being born and should promote contraception. I&#8217;ll agree with those two points, but the fact remains that having babies is not good for the environment. (Humans born into western society where consumption and pollution have a disproportionately massive impact on the environment. Even &#8220;green&#8221; westerners have a tremendous negative impact on the world environment. They&#8217;re only slight less worse than &#8220;regular&#8221; westerners.)  No matter how much you wish it weren&#8217;t so you can&#8217;t change reality. Even if the thought of negative population growth is bleak, that doesn&#8217;t mean it shouldn&#8217;t be done. Please don&#8217;t confuse the way you wish the world was with the way it is.</p><p>Do the editors of this site even read the articles posted?</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Beth Shea</title><link>http://www.inhabitots.com/2009/08/07/green-rant-babies-are-eco-baddies-or-so-the-argument-goes/comment-page-1/#comment-5773</link> <dc:creator>Beth Shea</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 10 Aug 2009 16:15:43 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.inhabitots.com/?p=18633#comment-5773</guid> <description>I think it&#039;s a very bleak viewpoint to ascertain that we&#039;re bringing children into such a negative world, laced with problems. Since the dawn of time, mankind has dealt with seemingly insurmountable issues, both ecological and cultural, and human beings have continued to overcome and keep existing. It&#039;s easy to blanket statement either side of this argument, but the beauty of humanity lies in the individual ways that people choose to view the world. There are indeed thoughtful, good people in the world who will bring their own children up to be wise, benevolent adults who perhaps may have the answers to the problems previous generations have created. There are too many subtleties for any kind of generalizations to be made with regard to continuing to populating the planet.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think it&#8217;s a very bleak viewpoint to ascertain that we&#8217;re bringing children into such a negative world, laced with problems. Since the dawn of time, mankind has dealt with seemingly insurmountable issues, both ecological and cultural, and human beings have continued to overcome and keep existing. It&#8217;s easy to blanket statement either side of this argument, but the beauty of humanity lies in the individual ways that people choose to view the world. There are indeed thoughtful, good people in the world who will bring their own children up to be wise, benevolent adults who perhaps may have the answers to the problems previous generations have created. There are too many subtleties for any kind of generalizations to be made with regard to continuing to populating the planet.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: kimsikes</title><link>http://www.inhabitots.com/2009/08/07/green-rant-babies-are-eco-baddies-or-so-the-argument-goes/comment-page-1/#comment-5772</link> <dc:creator>kimsikes</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 10 Aug 2009 15:05:13 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.inhabitots.com/?p=18633#comment-5772</guid> <description>Sorry Desmond, I&#039;m not buying your argument. More babies = more diapers, toys, cars, houses, shopping malls, food, water and all kinds of useless stuff ... period. And generally, parents are not raising their kids anymore - nannies, main-stream media, video games and our government are. So even the most enlightened parents don&#039;t have that much influence over their own children. Besides, what is there to leave to them anyway? Debt? Tainted food? A trashed planet? A broken justice system? Unprecedented rates of disease and poor health? Corrupt public servants? Corporate America? Hateful people who can&#039;t even wave thanks when you let them in front of you in traffic? We totally screwed this place up and we want our children to bathe in our gluttony and decadence? Forget it. There are still families who continue to steward the farmland that their ancestors left behind. They are self-sufficient and practical. They co-create with nature and heal the land. And they will leave a little piece of heaven for their children. Unless we&#039;re at this point, I don&#039;t believe it&#039;s fair that our children are a victim of our innate biological desire to procreate.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry Desmond, I&#8217;m not buying your argument. More babies = more diapers, toys, cars, houses, shopping malls, food, water and all kinds of useless stuff &#8230; period. And generally, parents are not raising their kids anymore &#8211; nannies, main-stream media, video games and our government are. So even the most enlightened parents don&#8217;t have that much influence over their own children. Besides, what is there to leave to them anyway? Debt? Tainted food? A trashed planet? A broken justice system? Unprecedented rates of disease and poor health? Corrupt public servants? Corporate America? Hateful people who can&#8217;t even wave thanks when you let them in front of you in traffic? We totally screwed this place up and we want our children to bathe in our gluttony and decadence? Forget it. There are still families who continue to steward the farmland that their ancestors left behind. They are self-sufficient and practical. They co-create with nature and heal the land. And they will leave a little piece of heaven for their children. Unless we&#8217;re at this point, I don&#8217;t believe it&#8217;s fair that our children are a victim of our innate biological desire to procreate.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: mj</title><link>http://www.inhabitots.com/2009/08/07/green-rant-babies-are-eco-baddies-or-so-the-argument-goes/comment-page-1/#comment-5770</link> <dc:creator>mj</dc:creator> <pubDate>Mon, 10 Aug 2009 01:00:08 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.inhabitots.com/?p=18633#comment-5770</guid> <description>macacanadian, if you follow your argument, what does it matter if we destroy our planet? In the grand scheme of the universe, it all doesn&#039;t matter. Our sun is going to swallow up earth anyway.I respect people who have decided not to have children greatly but what is it with all these generalisations about how wasteful families are and if you are intelligent you will choose this and that. I have been an environmental activist for a long time, this line of argument does not win people over. It  is easy to say how great you are and be self rightous but how effective are you being? How do you view people? Do you see the human or are they your enemy ?It is too late for alot of species on earth but humans are able to change things very quickly when there is a critical mass of people who are convinced a particular idea is worth it. And even if the worst case occurs environmentally, we in the first world will still survive. This is an extremely sad thought but there is opportunity to improve the outcome. We need to have some faith in people and work together. Parents have a lot invested in the future of the planet afterall.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>macacanadian, if you follow your argument, what does it matter if we destroy our planet? In the grand scheme of the universe, it all doesn&#8217;t matter. Our sun is going to swallow up earth anyway.</p><p>I respect people who have decided not to have children greatly but what is it with all these generalisations about how wasteful families are and if you are intelligent you will choose this and that. I have been an environmental activist for a long time, this line of argument does not win people over. It  is easy to say how great you are and be self rightous but how effective are you being? How do you view people? Do you see the human or are they your enemy ?</p><p>It is too late for alot of species on earth but humans are able to change things very quickly when there is a critical mass of people who are convinced a particular idea is worth it. And even if the worst case occurs environmentally, we in the first world will still survive. This is an extremely sad thought but there is opportunity to improve the outcome. We need to have some faith in people and work together. Parents have a lot invested in the future of the planet afterall.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Androo</title><link>http://www.inhabitots.com/2009/08/07/green-rant-babies-are-eco-baddies-or-so-the-argument-goes/comment-page-1/#comment-5768</link> <dc:creator>Androo</dc:creator> <pubDate>Sun, 09 Aug 2009 21:03:07 +0000</pubDate> <guid
isPermaLink="false">http://www.inhabitots.com/?p=18633#comment-5768</guid> <description>I will say that freedom to have children is a fundamental human right, since for most people, it&#039;s a genetic and emotional imperative that is probably far more powerful to them than any social contract they may enter into. Any attempts to regulate that right immediately get into some very sticky issues of personal freedom that I would rather never see abused or controlled.That said, while I believe it is a right, I think having children is tremendously bad choice on an intellectual level, and one that I hope I will never make. The world is better off with fewer people.Basically, if you&#039;re clever enough to be having this debate, chances are you shouldn&#039;t be having kids, because the other 95% of people in the world really don&#039;t care in the slightest, and will be having too many babies whether you like it or not.I suspect the world as a whole will have some very difficult decisions to make as the true ramifications of climate change become apparent over the next 20-50 years. Unfortunately, by that time the decisions will probably be moot, anyway. So it goes.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I will say that freedom to have children is a fundamental human right, since for most people, it&#8217;s a genetic and emotional imperative that is probably far more powerful to them than any social contract they may enter into. Any attempts to regulate that right immediately get into some very sticky issues of personal freedom that I would rather never see abused or controlled.</p><p>That said, while I believe it is a right, I think having children is tremendously bad choice on an intellectual level, and one that I hope I will never make. The world is better off with fewer people.</p><p>Basically, if you&#8217;re clever enough to be having this debate, chances are you shouldn&#8217;t be having kids, because the other 95% of people in the world really don&#8217;t care in the slightest, and will be having too many babies whether you like it or not.</p><p>I suspect the world as a whole will have some very difficult decisions to make as the true ramifications of climate change become apparent over the next 20-50 years. Unfortunately, by that time the decisions will probably be moot, anyway. So it goes.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> </channel> </rss>
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